Suggestion Box

Use this forum for title suggestions, bitching at moderators, whining about phpBB, and grand ideas that will solve all of Song Fight's problems.
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Kamakura
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Re: hardness (of working) also matters, apparently

Post by Kamakura »

bzl wrote:Show biz is what us lazy folks say instead of show business; perhaps you need to work harder on working less hard.
I'm aware of what show biz means, it's more the connotation. To me show biz is spangley suits, cheesy grins and the Osmonds, which is not where I'm at... I hope. 8)
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Post by boltoph »

I was just wondering something based on some feedback I got about songfight from someone else, I really don't want this to come out the wrong way or anything because it's not a problem or important or anything.

The question that was presented to me was "How can I tell which fights you've won or when they took place, when I'm looking at your archive?"

And with this question I say, Hmm...it would be pretty cool if the Artist's Name archive list of songs under a particular artists linked to the fights instead of just the actual MP3 files...that way you could look at an artists archive, see all the fights he or she's been in, and then see which ones he/she won, what the competition was like, what the cover art looked like, and then listen. It would mean that, say, sonofsupercar and Luke Henley's listing for "Ancient" under their artist names, would actually both link to the same page, this one: http://www.songfight.org/songpage.php?key=ancient

Now I am not complaining and I am gracious for the fact that there even is an archive at all, but just had this thought. If this idea were to be taken seriously, I'd be willing to help in whatever way I can to make updates...even if it was a manual process.
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Post by Kapitano »

Does it matter who won which fight? Or how many votes a song gets?

It probably feels nice for half an hour to win, but IMO voting comes after making music, hearing other people's music, getting feedback, and being part of an online community, in the list of things that are important about SongFight.

It might be nice if there was a little symbol next to winning songs in each artist's archive, meaning 'this song got the most votes in a fight'. Perhaps with a link to the relavent fight.
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erik
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Post by erik »

Kapitano wrote:It might be nice if there was a little symbol next to winning songs in each artist's archive, meaning 'this song got the most votes in a fight'. Perhaps with a link to the relavent fight.
Kapitano wrote:Does it matter who won which fight? Or how many votes a song gets?

It probably feels nice for half an hour to win, but IMO voting comes after making music, hearing other people's music, getting feedback, and being part of an online community, in the list of things that are important about SongFight.
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Post by boltoph »

I have to say, it's funny that we think it's great when Songfight gets recognition by magazines like Spin and online sites, yet I get the feeling that some people would prefer this doesn't turn into a well-known place.

And then I get feedback from outside perspective and all you guys can do is post messages about your personal opinions about what's important in Songfight. In a Suggestion Box, nonetheless. I mean, it's just a suggestion.

Let me reiterate my suggestion once and for all, and for the last time: I think it would be great if the Artist Archives were capable of taking you to the main fight page as well as, or instead of, posting the individual MP3's. That's all. It rocks the way it is anyway, but figured I'd drop a slip in the suggestion box here.

Personally I like going back in the archive, artist by artist, to:

1. see how they've developed through the course of their fights, starting from their first fight
2. see what fights they won

This depends on seeing the dates and the other contestants. As far as winning is concerned, what is the name of this site? What happens in a fight, when there's not a tie? Where in my previous post did I suggest that songfight is all about winning the fight?

Lastly, don't wet yer pants:
boltoph wrote:... it's not a problem or important or anything.
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Post by deshead »

boltoph wrote:it would be pretty cool if the Artist's Name archive list of songs under a particular artists linked to the fights instead of just the actual MP3 files
Or if there was a separate "(fight page)" link beside each MP3 link.
boltoph wrote:What happens in a fight, when there's not a tie?
A friend-flood? :wink:


Also, it's off-site (and a couple of weeks out of date) but Plat's Songfight Explorer does all the things you mentioned. I think your suggestion for the main archive is a good one, but even if it doesn't get added, when someone asks "how can I tell which fights you've won?" you can send them here.
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Post by boltoph »

Kapitano wrote:It might be nice if there was a little symbol next to winning songs in each artist's archive, meaning 'this song got the most votes in a fight'. Perhaps with a link to the relavent fight.
i see we're all kinda on the same page...except I just don't agree with "meaning 'this song got the most votes in a fight'."
It's to see the post-game and stats, comprehensive history of the players, as it relates to the game. It can also be done by going back to the Title archive, going back and forth and having two windows open. An icon would be cool for the less computer savvy but still wanting to hear tunes. I wouldn't share this with people that aren't gonna be honest and want to hear tunes, get into different songs and stuff.
deshead wrote:friend-flood
The music industry is cold, thats the way it is. In the long run though, it pans out. And I still swear, that one vote I got for "When It Snowed" wasn't me.
deshead wrote:Songfight Explorer
Thanks. I'm not sure if the proprieter is updating or not, but if so then that would be great. I know I've seen it. I'm calm now.
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Plat
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Post by Plat »

deshead wrote:Also, it's off-site (and a couple of weeks out of date) but Plat's Songfight Explorer does all the things you mentioned.
Just found this thread. Starting tonight I'll automate these updates, so they should be current within 24 hours of the songfight data changing. If you notice it go more than 48 hours out of date (even though it's still unofficial), please kick me in the balls via PM and I'll try to fixor.

Please note: current fights are not reflected in the Explorer, only completed fights.
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Post by j$ »

erikb wrote:
Kapitano wrote:It might be nice if there was a little symbol next to winning songs in each artist's archive, meaning 'this song got the most votes in a fight'. Perhaps with a link to the relavent fight.
Kapitano wrote:Does it matter who won which fight? Or how many votes a song gets?

It probably feels nice for half an hour to win, but IMO voting comes after making music, hearing other people's music, getting feedback, and being part of an online community, in the list of things that are important about SongFight.
People aren't allowed a change of heart these days? :)
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Post by boltoph »

Plat wrote:please kick me in the balls via PM and I'll try to fixor.
:o You might say that'd be going below the belt...But if you say so. Just not with workboots on...your Songfight Explorer is great! Thanks man.
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Post by JonPorobil »

j$ wrote:
erikb wrote:
Kapitano wrote:It might be nice if there was a little symbol next to winning songs in each artist's archive, meaning 'this song got the most votes in a fight'. Perhaps with a link to the relavent fight.
Kapitano wrote:Does it matter who won which fight? Or how many votes a song gets?

It probably feels nice for half an hour to win, but IMO voting comes after making music, hearing other people's music, getting feedback, and being part of an online community, in the list of things that are important about SongFight.
People aren't allowed a change of heart these days? :)
I don't even think those statements conflict. Yeah, voting and winning isn't important, except that they're integral to the concept for Songfight, so it'd be nice to know at a glance who the winner of a given fight was.
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roymond
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Post by roymond »

Generic wrote:I don't even think those statements conflict. Yeah, voting and winning isn't important, except that they're integral to the concept for Songfight, so it'd be nice to know at a glance who the winner of a given fight was.
In fact we are forced to be voted for and someone has to win. It's not like we like this. It's just the way things are. There should be a memorial plaque or something next to each winner "here lies the song that received the most votes"
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Post by j$ »

Generic wrote:I don't even think those statements conflict. Yeah, voting and winning isn't important, except that they're integral to the concept for Songfight, so it'd be nice to know at a glance who the winner of a given fight was.
And maybe a little cute wooden spoon designed by Bortwein for the one(s) that received the least?

we already have an indication of who won - it's called the number of votes by each song in the archive- if you need a little star then it's not about 'nice to know at a glance' it's about wanting a special kudos above the kudos for winning a fight. Even in a 30 song fight it's going to take, oh, 30 seconds to find the one with the most votes ...

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Post by bz£ »

j$ wrote:Even in a 30 song fight it's going to take, oh, 30 seconds to find the one with the most votes
No, it's going to take zero seconds because the fight main page says who the winner is. That's not the point.

What boltoph is sayin' is that, if you go to an artist page, all you get is an alphabetical list of all their entries. You don't see when each fight was, you don't know if any of them were winners. You can't even listen to the rest of the fight. All you get are links to mp3s. And that is not enough.

Kay? I know that the whole "how important is winning" question is so important that it has to be rehashed at least twice a week, but it's not what we're talking about this time.
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Post by j$ »

Hmmm, yeah, that was what I was saying - the request for a star on your artist page is rendered meaningless because you can click through to the fight page and scan up and down and see.

The artist presumably knows which fight(s) s/he has or hasn't won - so what possible point is there to that, apart from fronting to people who visit your artist page? Will it change their appreciation of the music they have already clicked on the artist to hear, to see they have won 17 fights or none? if it does, is that really the sort of person you want listening to your music?
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Post by Bjam »

Couldn't you just put it in your little artist profile thing that some people have if you're that bothered? Just add something that says "As of April 2005 I've won X amount of fights, those being X, Y, Z." Then just update it periodically. Probably easier :/
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Leaf
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Post by Leaf »

Who invited the sensible one?
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Post by boltoph »

j$ wrote:The artist presumably knows which fight(s) s/he has or hasn't won
But I don't know which fight was Redcar's first, and how they have fared since then. I don't know which one was your first fight or what you have won. You dig? Should I just PM every artist I like to get the info? No. For now, I will use the Songfight Explorer
Bjam wrote:Couldn't you just put it in your little artist profile thing that some people have if you're that bothered? Just add something that says "As of April 2005 I've won X amount of fights, those being X, Y, Z." Then just update it periodically. Probably easier :/
Um...not quite. Change all the "I's" and "you's" to the name of your favorite artist. I'm a fan of other people's music, not a self-absorbed drama queen. I don't have control over other people's profiles. What you are suggesting would be of no use to me because it'd only apply to MY songs, and obviously I already know which song was my first songfight song and which one's I've won.

Fortunately, the Songfight Explorer does the trick for me (thanks Plat, and Des). The public can just deal with it. If they wanna know more maybe they'll come here and find Plat's explorer. With Plat's explorer, I can review progress of my favorite artists. I can check out Luke Henley's first submission without going through every single fight page. I can easily find Forty Second Songs' first song and compare that to their rendition of "Snow Fort". I can trace the history of Redcar and see that the first logged submission was Moscow, Idaho and it won!! and their next tune won too! ROK! But hey...Turn the Power On seems to be missing from the Explorer...hmm

I think it would still be neat to see links to the fight pages under the artist archive.
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Post by erik »

j$ wrote:The artist presumably knows which fight(s) s/he has or hasn't won - so what possible point is there to that, apart from fronting to people who visit your artist page? Will it change their appreciation of the music they have already clicked on the artist to hear, to see they have won 17 fights or none? if it does, is that really the sort of person you want listening to your music?
Well, here is the thing. The archive is overwhelming, and if you get into songfight and start checking out the archive, beyond people you've heard of, it can be a daunting ordeal (for those of us without heirarchical iPod listening schemes). The gold star thing is kind of lame, for the reasons you mentioned, but at least it serves as some sort of jumping off point for the casual listener. Or the curious one.

I think that perhaps a better feature would be the ability to let every artist put a star next to one of their songs (with the default being their song which has achieved the highest percentage of the total votes), to mark it as the song of theirs that they feel is the best. That might get more people to dig through the archives, and it places the burden of deciding excellence on the artist, not on the voting population.
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Post by jack »

over on webjay, they have some sort of script or something that flags a song with a star after a certain number of downloads, like if it's gotten hit a hundred times it gets a star. kind of a cool feature. of course nothing will ever come of this suggestion but i just felt like mentioning it. :)
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Post by Spud »

Just. Stop. Now.
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Post by j$ »

erikb wrote:I think that perhaps a better feature would be the ability to let every artist put a star next to one of their songs (with the default being their song which has achieved the highest percentage of the total votes), to mark it as the song of theirs that they feel is the best.
I know I'm supposed to be shutting up. right. now. but can I just say in quiet tones that I think this is a great idea ....

sorry spud.

[/whisper]
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