You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Discuss upcoming, current, and previous song fights.
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by thirdcatmusic » Sun Dec 01, 2019 7:12 pm

loved the podcast - owl is a great guest! I liked hearing about your process working together on your song.
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by owl » Sun Dec 01, 2019 8:32 pm

gizo wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 6:26 pm
Chumpy wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 10:50 am
Hi there! Instead of writing down our reviews like normal folks, we like to record ourselves talking about them.

00:30:06 - gizo vs. the 17,455

Yow!
Thanks for the feedback - it's very helpful to me. I'm trying to get better, and hearing strangers have a conversation about something I've done is amazing to listen to and learn from. This podcast is fun and informative, and I really appreciate that.

FWIW, the very first attempt at pronunciation was correct.
AARGH I haaaate hearing myself talk (as I alluded to at the end of the podcast, unless the Jerks edited that part out) but I had to go in and listen just so I could find out which one that was. So, sounds like it rhymes with "Lizzo" (TL;DR to save everyone else the trouble if they also hate hearing me talk, haha)

Anyway thanks to Jerkatorium for having me on to share my dumb Opinions again, and for collaborating on this song, both were a lot of fun! And I'm sorry to everyone that I didn't get a chance to listen through a few more times before we recorded this, because I almost certainly missed cool nuances of everyone's work that I would have gotten if I'd had another week to listen and think some more.
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by Lunkhead » Sun Dec 01, 2019 8:37 pm

Simple Syrup wins but I confess it was hard not to give it to Jim Tyrrell and Third Cat. Great job you two!
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by owl » Sun Dec 01, 2019 8:41 pm

Sweet! Congrats Simple Syrup!
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by thirdcatmusic » Sun Dec 01, 2019 8:51 pm

Congrats to Simple Syrup on the win!
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by gizo » Sun Dec 01, 2019 10:17 pm

Congratulations, Syrup!
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by vowlvom » Sun Dec 01, 2019 11:57 pm

Congrats, Syrup!

I didn't get around to reviewing this time but my favourite was gizo's song, and I enjoyed Jim Tyrrell and Mandibles very much also. Looking forward to checking out the podcast!
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by gizo » Mon Dec 02, 2019 1:30 am

vowlvom wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 11:57 pm
Congrats, Syrup!

I didn't get around to reviewing this time but my favourite was gizo's song, and I enjoyed Jim Tyrrell and Mandibles very much also. Looking forward to checking out the podcast!
Swoon.....

High praise indeed. Thanks!
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by crumpart » Mon Dec 02, 2019 1:41 am

gizo wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 6:26 pm
Chumpy wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 10:50 am
Hi there! Instead of writing down our reviews like normal folks, we like to record ourselves talking about them.

00:30:06 - gizo vs. the 17,455

Yow!
Thanks for the feedback - it's very helpful to me. I'm trying to get better, and hearing strangers have a conversation about something I've done is amazing to listen to and learn from. This podcast is fun and informative, and I really appreciate that.

FWIW, the very first attempt at pronunciation was correct.
I’m definitely calling you Cheeso forever now. Maybe it will stop my phone calling you Biz.
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by gizo » Mon Dec 02, 2019 2:15 am

Please don’t.
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by crumpart » Mon Dec 02, 2019 2:21 am

gizo wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 2:15 am
Please don’t.
OK Biz.
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by AJOwens » Mon Dec 02, 2019 8:05 am

I haven't even listened to all the entries yet, didn't vote, and I probably won't be doing reviews for this fight. But I did get as far as The Magnetic Letters and I would definitely have voted for it on the strength of the lyrics, which had two takes on the title within an interesting composition.

I don't understand how I got eight votes, but thanks to whoever liked my meta song.
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by fluffy » Mon Dec 02, 2019 2:37 pm

Oops, for some reason I stopped getting notifications on this thread. phpBB, you so silly.

Anyway!
Chumpy wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 10:50 am
Hi there! Instead of writing down our reviews like normal folks, we like to record ourselves talking about them.
The glockenspiel did indeed manage to cut through the mix pretty harshly because of its location in the frequency spectrum (although I like to think that it's the intrusive thoughts that are keeping me awake to begin with), but it is absolutely not hard-panned:
Screen-Shot-2019-12-02-at-1.26.07-PM.png
Screen-Shot-2019-12-02-at-1.26.07-PM.png (28.48 KiB) Viewed 168 times
So maybe it's your left ear that's full of waxy buildup, Chumpy.

Anyway my entry was just a last-minute thing I did as part of Novembeat so the mix quality could definitely be improved, which it will be for the obligatory album release when I get around to it.
Merle Fyshwick wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 11:52 pm
Sock Puppet - Those keys; I think I've heard them somewhere before...This one almost gave me tingles, 'virtual haircut' style, the first one to do it. Oh yeah, that's right - you were explaining ASMR in the pre-fight, so good work on the ASMR!
And I'm glad that worked on someone other than me!
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by crumpart » Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:24 am

Berkeley Social Scene:
Overall I really like this. The think the “Right. Now. It’s time...” section in particular is really strong. I’m not sure that some of the drumming rhythm choices entirely gel, but that’s just a niggly thing and I think overall the song is good.

CazaroTaro:
I really like the keys in this, and all the instrumentation in fact, especially the little horn sparkles. I don’t feel like the vocal delivery/treatment sits super well with the instrumentation. I feel like the delivery needs more enthusiasm and charm injected in somehow so that you can sell the idea both sonically and lyrically.

The Dormouse Choir:
Your voice has a lot of character and is really enjoyable to listen to, and the storytelling nature of the lyrics is wonderful. I think this is a really solid, good song. The guitar playing is a little buzzy, but I think the aim to bring some dynamics to the song through the guitar works overall.

Evil Grin:
I didn't have the same reaction as everyone else to the sex sounds. I'm not sure if this is because I recently listened to George Michael's 'I Want Your Sex' in its entirety, which is essentially nine minutes of George emphasising the word "come", or because the week before I listened to Prince, aka King of the Single Entendre, singing a song called 'Come' for over 11 minutes and now I'm desensitised. Oh, the eighties. I feel like you’re probably not into high pop, but check out Julia Michaels, who is a big name young songwriter for a lot of pop stars. She released her own debut ep a few years ago and it’s very rhythmically interesting in terms of asmr type sounds. There’s a song on it called ‘Pink’, which is very different to your song stylistically, but is similar in terms of female sexual directness, and uses breathy type sex sounds as rhythm and to give an edge to the vocal delivery. Other songs aside, I enjoyed this and I like the way this started and ended on the same line.

gizo vs. the 17,455:
Original review: That opening guitar instantly makes me happy. I love all the sounds in this. Reminds me of Melbourne. There’s a bit that gets kind of swallowed by that big building whoosh sound about 1’45”, but I think in the context of the ASMR challenge that works. This reminds me a lot of Cardinal. I like that you’re really leaning into your accent.
Updated review: I just listened to this about five times in a row, and now love the big building whoosh. I’m not sure if this is specifically about Scott Morrison or Australian politics in general, but it takes me back to the feeling earlier this year when I’d flown the 17,445, and sat on your couch watching the election count. God, I’m so, so fucking sick of all those horrible people who pride themselves on doing terrible things. And then, 17,445km and back again is a lot of oil burned... So, this song makes me super sad, but also really happy because it’s an excellent song.

Hot Pink Halo:
Me again. I’m glad some people picked up on the idea that this was written from the typewriter’s perspective. The percussion is all played through in about seven layers on my lifelong, childhood typewriter, except for the bell, which was really difficult to time, so I recorded it once then placed it where I wanted it to go. There’s a track of the shift lock key and another of the regular shift key, and both of those were pitch shifted down an octave. One of the tracks is a bunch of the regular keys being hit all at once to make a glittery, sparkly sound, one is finger drumming on the top of the typewriter, one is a single letter key being struck lightly in time, one is a letter key hitting hard (difficult to record without clipping), and there’s some carriage sliding through the choruses. I shifted the timing a little using automation as it’s difficult control all the natural sounds a typewriter makes (like releasing the shift lock key for example, the typewriter doesn’t do it with the exact same timing consistently), and I wanted a degree of uniformity. I wanted the whole thing to sound like it was longing for a time in the past, so I set my bpm to 88 and went back, way back to that lovely 50s progression, changing it up in the choruses a little with some suspended, 7th, 9th and 5th variations. The idea is that the harmonies would build in layers throughout the song, reaching a peak in the last chorus. I was super sick and phlegmy when I recorded them, so tried to leave it as late as possible, which probably wasn’t a great idea, as my ears also weren’t working well for the mixing and I didn’t have time to rest my brain/ears and listen again before sending it in. I’d like to make the vocals a little more present and higher in the mix overall, but I do like that it kind of sounds like they’re coming out of the typewriter.

James Owens:
Yo, stop talking down on your own songs. I enjoyed this a lot, and you dissing it only serves to make the people who enjoy it feel like you think they’re dum dums for doing so. It’s well made, it’s cute, and it made me laugh. One of the lessons I’ve learned in life is just to be all in on things that you’ve made no matter how ridiculous or throwaway they are. You made a fun, silly song and tbh the world needs more fun silly songs; own it.

Jim Tyrrell:
This is a nice song, but there’s nothing in it that really makes it stand out as memorable for me. I don’t think it’s genre bias, because I like this genre, just that it’s lacking a little in terms of character; it’s too easy to see where it’s going.

Lichen Throat:
I find this a lot easier to process when I listen through headphones than I do through any of the other speakers in the house which is interesting to me; it’s somehow like the things in it that are off kilter work better when they have a direct line to my ears and brain.

Lollypops and the Sour Straps:
True story time: when I was about seven or so, I’d shut myself in my Mum and Dad’s bedroom, which had the only full length mirror in the house, and I’d sing and dance to my favourite album (not going to say what it was, because that would give away too many password secret questions...), and one day my sister hid under their bed so that she could catch me doing it and jumped out at me mid song. It was DEVASTATING and I’ve never forgotten it. I didn’t sing by myself in front of anyone for years, which was probably exacerbated by marrying someone with perfect pitch and no poker face. I don’t have many regrets, but one of them is secretly caring so much about people judging me for enjoying singing. I often think about how much better I’d be at singing now if I’d had people encourage me musically when I was a kid. So anyway, all that to say that it made me SUPER HAPPY to hear that you’d gone off and secretly recorded a song then insisted that it be sent in. That takes an enormous amount of courage and I wouldn’t have even known where to start with writing a song at 11. I think your chorus is excellent, and you seem much more confident with the melody in the chorus than you are with the verses. You’ve arranged the song dynamically really well, and I love the bit where almost everything drops out except your voice, then comes back in with the piano. Definitely stealing some of these arrangement ideas for future use.

The Magnetic Letters:
Try me, maaaaate.
This does not feel near 4’23” long. I love that background sound that someone has said is a theramin. All the phrasing and delivery of lyrics is excellent. You have that special skill with your lyric writing where I’m really able to visually imagine the scenes that are set.

Mandibles:
I love Alice in Wonderland and have used it a lot in my art over time. That love was not enough to overcome my anti-“asmr” sentiment with this song. I find it very uncomfortable and don’t like listening to it. It’s not you, it’s me.

Miscellaneous Jerk:
I love that arpeggiated sound in this. All the instrumentation and the vocal delivery are excellent, but I’d personally like to hear a little more sparkle in the voice, just to really offset the lyrics. Sounds like you’ve been listening to Frente!
Update: listening to the talk about the challenges faced with collaboration and the timing that you ended up with in the song was super interesting. Great podcast episode, and I definitely listen to the whole thing, not just my own review! I mean, I listened to my own review first, but then I went back and listened from the start.

Phlebia:
I kind of love the onslaught of this. You did a better job of making the lyrics clearer in the mix this time around. I think it’s a good length considering the intensity. I like where you go up high on try me, and the discombobulation at the end is a fitting finish.

Simple Syrup:
This is a sweet sad song. I think all the instrumentation works well. There are one or two spots where the backing vocal seems to fumble a word. The idea of buying something just to throw it away makes me sad, but this is a sad song, so that line works in context. Down with capitalism! Unless you’re buying things from me. In that instance, yay capitalism! (Offer code MORTGAGE and I’m not even kidding mostly!)

Sockpuppet:
I love lullabies and a love glockenspiels, but the glockenspiel is just too loud and not sitting well in the mix for me. If the glock wasn’t so ear piercing I would love it. Interestingly, I’m hearing it as mostly right ear as well, and it’s super interesting to find out it’s not panned that way at all.

Third Cat:
I don’t think this stood out to me on the first listen, but having given it some time it’s really grown on me. I think the first time through I was frustrated because I was enjoying the opening section so much and right when I was really getting into it that big change came it and shook me out of it. Which was entirely the point. Definitely a winner on repeat listens.
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by fluffy » Tue Dec 03, 2019 11:34 am

I actually do feel like it’s more on the right too and I wonder if maybe the glockspiel is actually getting panned by my multi band compressor somehow, like there’s enough other treble on the left that it’s causing that band to get ducked on the left but boosted on the right. As I work on mastering it for the album release I’ll experiment with some things.
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Re: You wouldn't dare... (Try Me Reviews)

Post by owl » Wed Dec 04, 2019 12:58 pm

crumpart wrote:
Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:24 am
Hot Pink Halo:
Me again. I’m glad some people picked up on the idea that this was written from the typewriter’s perspective. The percussion is all played through in about seven layers on my lifelong, childhood typewriter, except for the bell, which was really difficult to time, so I recorded it once then placed it where I wanted it to go. There’s a track of the shift lock key and another of the regular shift key, and both of those were pitch shifted down an octave. One of the tracks is a bunch of the regular keys being hit all at once to make a glittery, sparkly sound, one is finger drumming on the top of the typewriter, one is a single letter key being struck lightly in time, one is a letter key hitting hard (difficult to record without clipping), and there’s some carriage sliding through the choruses. I shifted the timing a little using automation as it’s difficult control all the natural sounds a typewriter makes (like releasing the shift lock key for example, the typewriter doesn’t do it with the exact same timing consistently), and I wanted a degree of uniformity. I wanted the whole thing to sound like it was longing for a time in the past, so I set my bpm to 88 and went back, way back to that lovely 50s progression, changing it up in the choruses a little with some suspended, 7th, 9th and 5th variations. The idea is that the harmonies would build in layers throughout the song, reaching a peak in the last chorus. I was super sick and phlegmy when I recorded them, so tried to leave it as late as possible, which probably wasn’t a great idea, as my ears also weren’t working well for the mixing and I didn’t have time to rest my brain/ears and listen again before sending it in. I’d like to make the vocals a little more present and higher in the mix overall, but I do like that it kind of sounds like they’re coming out of the typewriter.

James Owens:
Yo, stop talking down on your own songs. I enjoyed this a lot, and you dissing it only serves to make the people who enjoy it feel like you think they’re dum dums for doing so. It’s well made, it’s cute, and it made me laugh. One of the lessons I’ve learned in life is just to be all in on things that you’ve made no matter how ridiculous or throwaway they are. You made a fun, silly song and tbh the world needs more fun silly songs; own it.

Lollypops and the Sour Straps:
True story time: when I was about seven or so, I’d shut myself in my Mum and Dad’s bedroom, which had the only full length mirror in the house, and I’d sing and dance to my favourite album (not going to say what it was, because that would give away too many password secret questions...), and one day my sister hid under their bed so that she could catch me doing it and jumped out at me mid song. It was DEVASTATING and I’ve never forgotten it. I didn’t sing by myself in front of anyone for years, which was probably exacerbated by marrying someone with perfect pitch and no poker face. I don’t have many regrets, but one of them is secretly caring so much about people judging me for enjoying singing. I often think about how much better I’d be at singing now if I’d had people encourage me musically when I was a kid. So anyway, all that to say that it made me SUPER HAPPY to hear that you’d gone off and secretly recorded a song then insisted that it be sent in. That takes an enormous amount of courage and I wouldn’t have even known where to start with writing a song at 11. I think your chorus is excellent, and you seem much more confident with the melody in the chorus than you are with the verses. You’ve arranged the song dynamically really well, and I love the bit where almost everything drops out except your voice, then comes back in with the piano. Definitely stealing some of these arrangement ideas for future use.
I really enjoyed hearing about your process for recording and layering all your typewriter noises!

I also liked your lovely advice to James Owens and Lollypops. You seem pretty creatively fearless, and it's hard to imagine you (as far as I know you from ye olde Internet, anyway) being particularly afraid of what people think. I appreciate you sharing a little bit about Small Crumpart and it not always being that way. And I will second Lollypops's chorus being very good! I don't remember if I specifically said anything about that on the podcast, but it was in my notes (I made a note that it reminded me of the Smiths).

It reminded me that I meant to drop a link to Girls Rock Camp, which I mentioned on the podcast, for gizo or anyone else who has or knows kids who might be interested--it's a worldwide organization. At least one of them, GRC Fox Cities here in Wisconsin, which my band played a fundraiser for at some point, is fully funded as well, so campers pay nothing to attend (sadly, the first year, there wasn't even enough interest in the Fox Cities camp to run it that year despite it being free!)
gizo wrote:
Sun Nov 24, 2019 8:12 pm
The guidance on singing technique is awesome thanks - Lollypops does a lot of singing at school, but there's a real difference when she's exposed to a mic.
There was a part in Carrie Brownstein's memoir that totally hit home for me where she talks about their disastrous first gig, and not knowing anything about how live sound works, and everything turning into a total shitshow with regards to mics, monitors, etc., and wishing something like GRC had been around to help them learn.

I'm sure every musician, no matter their gender, has a similar coming-of-age learning experience story. But I also think there's a pretty common attitude, ranging from super subtle/unconscious bias or sometimes not-so-subtle, that DIY music is a men's world and everyone else is a guest, so it's maybe a bit easier to overcome the challenges and keep going if you have actual training and a supportive atmosphere in that particular context.

I took music in school and years of piano lessons as a kid and my piano teacher was lovely and all, but classical training is also kind of terrible for encouraging creativity and songwriting, so I think traditional music lessons are a whole different beast than what GRC teaches.

But I digress, just wanted to say I hope Lollypops keeps going with making music, any way she wants to, and it's awesome that her dad is there to help and support her in learning about all this stuff too :)
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